vitamin C

[allryoops]

I have recently seen a couple of articles talking about intervienous vit.C given in high doses (by a naturopath) and I'm wondering if anyone knows of this treatment for HCV.  I understand it must be done about 10-20 times. Any imput?? 8)alley

[straighten_up]

Don't know about injectable vit C.   But -  Vit C  is useful and generally regarded as non- toxic.  There are some doctors that have advocated Vit C as a powerful anti- viral therapy in itself, as well as being an essential nutrient.  Mega doses have been used to treat cancer patients with mixed results, so this idea is not new.   Sounds like the naturopath could be aiming for "bowl tolerance" dosage which means the patient takes as much Vit C before developing diarrhea.  However, in order to have an anti -viral effect, one must also take other nutrients such as zinc, manganese, selenium, and vitamins A, B, and E, according to sources.

Vitamin C also supports the body's collagen production. Collagen is a protien that makes up much of the connective tissue and constitutes the basement membrane of the glomeruli in the kidneys, which can often be diseased in hcv patients.  

In some people,  high doses of Vit C may result in increased iron uptake from the bowl, and therefore could be hazardous for  patients with high levels of iron in the liver cells.  It is worth considering that a healthy immune system is not neccesarily a hyper-active one.  

Taken in supplement form, sources suggest magnesium ascorbate or calcium ascorbate  rather than ascorbate acid as these forms are more easily assimiliated.
Chelated forms are the best absorbed.  Preparations with bioflavanoids are considered to be the most effective.  However,  I had a Chinese acupuncturist tell me that most everything you buy in the store is a synthetic form of Vit C even if it says "natural" and structurally different than genuinely natural Vit C.  He suggested also that high doses could be a potential irritant to the liver.   I take about  8000 mg or more (which is not all that high) a day, skipping some days,  and my tests are normal.

Perhaps a common sense approach that says the overall health of the body is what's desirable,  in other words, a "magic bullet"  Vit C probably is not  (or we would have heard about it by now)  however, it appears to be an important part of the overall health of the body, which should be the aim of any alternative therapy, in my opinion.  By aiming to bring the health of the entire body,  and immune system,  to optimal performance we  can  therefore minimize the damage done by the virus, and  render it relatively harmless,  while we wait for a better day, or die  from some other cause other than Hep C.

There are reports of individuals who have gone "undetectable"  (whatever that means)  by restoring their health in such a way as to give no grounds for the virus to exist.  After all, we know that a certain percentage of people "clear"  on their own, without help. ( although the idea that anybody really "clears"  the virus has yet to be proven)    Why?  One reason could be because their bodies are in good health and their immune systems are functioning at peak performance.  

If we don't approach the health concept in an comprehensive fashion,   we continue to allow conditions in our body that permit the virus to proliferate unchecked.  In other words, every aspect of our health must be addressed, not just one or two.  It probably doesn't do much good to inject high doses of Vit C  and eat donuts or junk food  every day - you are  self -defeating  that way.  Everybody is different in their nutritional requirments and the overall state of their health;  by careful study and observation one can begin this life - long course of action that can only result in improvement of one's chances for a normal  life.

I  would proceed only with  caution if I were you, and question how much the naturopath really knows about Hep C and the liver.  Listen to what your body is telling you, and get as informed as much as you possibly can.    If all that doesn't confuse you,  I don't know what will.      Good luck.

[catsRus]

I will try to shed some light on the holistic approach and the ascorbate injections as described by a naturopath who is considered fairly up on HCV. Also some other comments on straighten up's enlightened comments.

The naturopath will want to evaluate your situation, they will interview you and find out what supplements you are taking (he said he liked people to bring them with) then they will do analysis to determine any deficiencies. After a through inventory they will recommend what needs to be done to get your immune system and other functions healthy. After things are up to a desirable level then such things as IV ascorbate will be tried.

As far as the IV ascorbate goes he said it was about 40 grams in a solution, the idea being to kill the virus in the blood. This was several years ago and was fairly new for HCV, but he did elaborate on his use of the same treatment for cancer. There was no mention of bowl intolerance, so I am assuming it is not an issue with IV usage because no one is able to tolerate 40 grams in one dose orally.  He was quick to point out there is NO cure for HCV and it is your immune system that will ultimately make you undetectable not any treatment.

The warnings brought up are valid questions. I have no answers about mega doses of ascorbate hurting your liver. Serum ferritin (Iron) levels can harm your liver more than the HCV, adult males and non-menstruating women especially should have their serum ferritin levels checked. (Serum ferritin damage looks just like HCV damage on you liver enzyme panel) and if above 100 you need to lower it. Here is a link about Iron levels.
http://www.mercola.com/2002/dec/18/iron_diagnosis.htm

Undetectable, that is a good point there are newer studies that suggest that the hep will always be with you in your liver, spleen or pancreas. So the whole body approach to wellness is the only answer to keeping it undetectable. The best person to do this is the patient themselves only you know what you really put in your body and what is really bothering you. The one size fits all idea of a cure is why HEP C is so hard to treat it is not a universal disease it is individual to each that carries it and the treatment and "cure" is also!

The comprehensive approach is a tall order more akin to a lifestyle change rather than the silver bullet so many are looking for.

[straighten_up]

Yeah!   what he said... A lifestyle change...the environment inside your body, inside your head, and the environment  you live in,   if need be.

The body fights best when all it's elements fight together..as one being,   in concert.. the body has to have fuel to do this.  Knowledge is the first fuel you need.  Yes it's a tall order..but when you realize there's  nowhere else to go,  it's not so bad after all.  Infinitely preferable to living in misery. let me tell you.   You just put one foot in front of the other, and then..you're walking.  

Anyway, "undetectable" is not the same as "eradication, "  what can you prove with a pcr test,   but perhaps that is another topic..